Columbus to the North; Pilgrims to the South
I was recently having conversation with an American friend who was here in Nicaragua about anything from Seinfeld being the funniest man alive to hydrogen fuel economy and a shocking statement came out of this man’s mouth. I’ve never heard anyone say this before in my life. Let me preface by saying that I respect this gentleman immensely and He is has taught me a great deal. In a lot of ways I could model myself after Him. He is intelligent, caring, wise, a family man, entrepreneurial, sensitive, and yet as brash as any man should be. I’m not saying that I disagree with what He said; it’s only that it seemed far too blanket to hold water. I needed more than just that. I’ve got to know if there is validity to this. I should have forced him to walk me through all of the Theology that has led him to this place because if it’s true; my current thoughts of how God dishes out his blessing are surely flawed and I need to change. Actually, I’m quite sure that if this is true; the domino effect of what all else must be true is too much for me to fathom right now.
So……….if Columbus had landed at Plymouth Rock bringing Catholicism in full force to North America and the Pilgrims had landed somewhere in Central/South America bringing a liberated Lutheran based group of Puritans along with a better understanding of God’s grace and such. The nations would be completely flip flopped in terms of economic prosperity, militaristic strength, and religious make-up.
Now, the religious make-up I can understand; but does that necessarily mean that there couldn’t have been certain sparks that would have flown in the brains of smart Spaniards that would have led to an industrial revolution of sorts and sent economic prosperity sky-rocketing in a Spanish dominated North America. Could there have been different circumstances in the South that would have propelled Spanish prosperity in spite of their Catholic religion which is not wholly based in the grace of Jesus Christ. I’ve lately believed that God ultimately allows the world to move and change in it’s own way without bestowing blessings based on merit. I rather believe that God changes people from within allowing them to become liberated spiritually from the bondage of their own sin which creates a sort of peace and beauty that cannot necessarily be seen in the context of an entire nation or people group. I have believed that God’s desire to know and transform people from within changes the way that they interact with their surrounding culture and economy within their specific locale. We all know that on a personal level; our relationship with Jesus Christ doesn’t necessarily translate into wealth. In fact; Jesus himself claimed that he had no place to lay his head. His disciples didn’t seem to become healthy, wealthy, and wise but rather dead, poor, and wise! They say that two out of three ain’t bad and but I’m going to say that 1 out of 3 in this field is probably quite bad. Ok, so I’m comparing the success of God’s people as a whole to the individual which perhaps is unfair and not a given. I’m willing to entertain that they should be looked at differently. Open my eyes! Anybody?
The problem is; I’m finding it hard to believe that God blessed the United States as a whole b/c it was based in the truth of the word of God. Let’s look at the countries of the world that are the most economically healthy and also blessing the world through their giving per capita. (I say that b/c I think that if you can identify that the majority of a nation boasts Christianity then you also need to look at their giving as a group to determine some sort of validity) Are these nations also “Christian” in that they are nations who are predominately claiming the truth of God in that the rescue of the world is only found in Jesus Christ? That would be a good start I think. If I can see that God is blessing “as a whole” all of the people groups that are collectively “following Him”. I’ll buy it. Otherwise; I think that this outlook is false. As it stands; I don’t think that God’s FINANCIAL or ECONOMIC blessing on people or (people groups / Nations) rests in their ability to “Follow Him”.
Now watch me change my mind here……
BUT, BUT, BUT if God wants to bring His Kingdom of Heaven here to earth and if God originally built this place perfect and Rob Bell’s ideas regarding the New Heaven and the New Earth working in perfect harmony because everyone is pulling their own weight and doing the things that God has designed them to do. THEN, THEN, THEN, perhaps it is true. Perhaps following the ways of Jesus which INCLUDES prevailing Justice in the world “all of the time”. The blessing would be in and of itself; the result of perfect harmony in the world. Perhaps our shot at life here the NEW WORLD being rooted in Jesus was one of the best attempts lately (in the past 2000 years) at the Kingdom of Heaven coming here on the earth. Now that other ideologies or Faith Systems (mostly a Darwinesque, Relativist, Atheism or Agnosticism) are seemingly taking over in the US; are we maybe losing some ground and ultimately following the path of destruction that has prevailed since Adam bit the apple. OR, OR, OR perhaps there is a new framework for what we used to call “REVIVAL” being laid down that could potentially bring the US and/or the world again closer to the Kingdom of God. I’m not exactly sure what the Bible claims about my next statement, but it seems to me that if this world doesn’t become the Kingdom that God intends it to be; then it will have to be destroyed. Sidenote: I’m pulling for it not to be destroyed!
Perhaps there is validity to his statement then. I’ve actually had to write myself through this to get to where I’m at. If you’re reading; you’re actually seeing my thought process an it may have confused the crap out of you. I could keep this to myself and a few close friends, or I could send it into the blogosphere for comment. I suppose holding it to myself and allowing more time to fine tune my thoughts would be sort of selfish and self serving. I could put a lot more into this and make myself look pretty smart. But this is a journey that the world must all take together and so I think I’m going to go ahead and release this out there………even if it does portray my own personal ignorance.
Comments please? I’m sure many of you have already thought much of this through are much further along than I.
So……….if Columbus had landed at Plymouth Rock bringing Catholicism in full force to North America and the Pilgrims had landed somewhere in Central/South America bringing a liberated Lutheran based group of Puritans along with a better understanding of God’s grace and such. The nations would be completely flip flopped in terms of economic prosperity, militaristic strength, and religious make-up.
Now, the religious make-up I can understand; but does that necessarily mean that there couldn’t have been certain sparks that would have flown in the brains of smart Spaniards that would have led to an industrial revolution of sorts and sent economic prosperity sky-rocketing in a Spanish dominated North America. Could there have been different circumstances in the South that would have propelled Spanish prosperity in spite of their Catholic religion which is not wholly based in the grace of Jesus Christ. I’ve lately believed that God ultimately allows the world to move and change in it’s own way without bestowing blessings based on merit. I rather believe that God changes people from within allowing them to become liberated spiritually from the bondage of their own sin which creates a sort of peace and beauty that cannot necessarily be seen in the context of an entire nation or people group. I have believed that God’s desire to know and transform people from within changes the way that they interact with their surrounding culture and economy within their specific locale. We all know that on a personal level; our relationship with Jesus Christ doesn’t necessarily translate into wealth. In fact; Jesus himself claimed that he had no place to lay his head. His disciples didn’t seem to become healthy, wealthy, and wise but rather dead, poor, and wise! They say that two out of three ain’t bad and but I’m going to say that 1 out of 3 in this field is probably quite bad. Ok, so I’m comparing the success of God’s people as a whole to the individual which perhaps is unfair and not a given. I’m willing to entertain that they should be looked at differently. Open my eyes! Anybody?
The problem is; I’m finding it hard to believe that God blessed the United States as a whole b/c it was based in the truth of the word of God. Let’s look at the countries of the world that are the most economically healthy and also blessing the world through their giving per capita. (I say that b/c I think that if you can identify that the majority of a nation boasts Christianity then you also need to look at their giving as a group to determine some sort of validity) Are these nations also “Christian” in that they are nations who are predominately claiming the truth of God in that the rescue of the world is only found in Jesus Christ? That would be a good start I think. If I can see that God is blessing “as a whole” all of the people groups that are collectively “following Him”. I’ll buy it. Otherwise; I think that this outlook is false. As it stands; I don’t think that God’s FINANCIAL or ECONOMIC blessing on people or (people groups / Nations) rests in their ability to “Follow Him”.
Now watch me change my mind here……
BUT, BUT, BUT if God wants to bring His Kingdom of Heaven here to earth and if God originally built this place perfect and Rob Bell’s ideas regarding the New Heaven and the New Earth working in perfect harmony because everyone is pulling their own weight and doing the things that God has designed them to do. THEN, THEN, THEN, perhaps it is true. Perhaps following the ways of Jesus which INCLUDES prevailing Justice in the world “all of the time”. The blessing would be in and of itself; the result of perfect harmony in the world. Perhaps our shot at life here the NEW WORLD being rooted in Jesus was one of the best attempts lately (in the past 2000 years) at the Kingdom of Heaven coming here on the earth. Now that other ideologies or Faith Systems (mostly a Darwinesque, Relativist, Atheism or Agnosticism) are seemingly taking over in the US; are we maybe losing some ground and ultimately following the path of destruction that has prevailed since Adam bit the apple. OR, OR, OR perhaps there is a new framework for what we used to call “REVIVAL” being laid down that could potentially bring the US and/or the world again closer to the Kingdom of God. I’m not exactly sure what the Bible claims about my next statement, but it seems to me that if this world doesn’t become the Kingdom that God intends it to be; then it will have to be destroyed. Sidenote: I’m pulling for it not to be destroyed!
Perhaps there is validity to his statement then. I’ve actually had to write myself through this to get to where I’m at. If you’re reading; you’re actually seeing my thought process an it may have confused the crap out of you. I could keep this to myself and a few close friends, or I could send it into the blogosphere for comment. I suppose holding it to myself and allowing more time to fine tune my thoughts would be sort of selfish and self serving. I could put a lot more into this and make myself look pretty smart. But this is a journey that the world must all take together and so I think I’m going to go ahead and release this out there………even if it does portray my own personal ignorance.
Comments please? I’m sure many of you have already thought much of this through are much further along than I.
posted by Alan Wilser at 2:59 PM
3 Comments:
i don't have much worthwhile to say, but i will mention that it did make me think of the ben folds song "all u can eat" ... the lyric i'm thinking of is: "God made us number one 'cause he loves us the best, Well he should go bless someone else for a while and give us a rest" ... the entire song is kind of a dig at american culture
or more accurately, a dig at american consumerism and the neglect for others outside of our great nation.
Everyone should read Has Democracy Had Its Day" by Carl F. Henry, it speaks much to the idea of the US being a Christian nation from the beginning until now and whether or not that is the case. Alan my further thoughts will hopefully be added this evening. Thanks for always struggling through the deep water and letting us in to struggle with you.
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